Soybean Oil?

[Twanoh Tom]

My best local source of WVO has recently switched from a partially hydrogenated oil to soybean oil. My first clue was when I stopped by to pump the barrel (an every Wednesday routine) I noticed that in spite of the freezing weather, the oil was very liquid and a darker amber instead of the usual thick milky goop. A check in the adjacent dumpster revealed the original cardboard box the cube came in with the "soy oil" label. I've had satisfactory results burning the partially hydrogenated oil but now that I am between veggiemobiles I haven't had a chance to burn this new oil. It sure is nicer to pump and remains very liquid in this freezing weather. It is still settling so I haven't filtered it yet but I am anticipating faster filtering as well. My question is: Does anyone know anything about soy oil?
TT

[cgoodwin]

This is from Journey to Forever

""In autumn 2001 an injection pump was damaged for the first time ... so that an exchange was necessary. The vehicle had previously been driven without problems for two years. An examination of the defective sections found substantial surface erosion of the hardened steel high pressure parts, which are not acid-proof." The problem was traced to a supply of soy oil which was not the usual food-grade oil and had a high acid-content. BioCar (German page):
http://biocar.de/info/warnung1.htm (http://biocar.de/info/warnung1.htm)"

And this from http://www.distributiondrive.com/products%20conversion%20kits.html



"A quick note about Soy bean oil as a fuel Soybean oil is not really a suitable oil for powering diesel engines whether it is straight vegetable oil or soybean based 100% Biodiesel. The reason for this is that in diesel engines you have slight mixing between fuel and lubricating oil and there is a property of soybean oil that makes it reactive when in contact with engine lubricating oil.

This characteristic means that it has a polymerizing action with the engine oil, which is detrimental to the life of your lubricating system. In Europe they do not use soybean oil; they use rape seed also known as canola here in the US and do not suffer this issue nearly as badly as soy.

To counteract this polymerizing of the lubricating oil, you can more frequently change oil or use vegetable oil based lubricating oil. In the case of B20 Biodiesel, this is not an issue as the concentrations of Biodiesel are much lower and vehicles running most Biodiesel blends, even as high as 70% do not experience any difficulties. "

Interesting since almost all the Biodiesel available in the US is made from Soy and I have not heard of any issues.

Chris

[Twanoh Tom]

Hmmmm. Thanks for the info. This makes me a little nervous. Unfortunately, this establishment with the soy oil has been my best resource locally (about 60 gal/month).
TT

[cgoodwin]

Don't get nervous, get informed. Let the post ride a while and while waiting do a google on "soy svo wvo"

Chris

[KansasDiesel]

If the soybean oil is cut with other oil is it as damaging? :(
I too am about to get soy bean oil from a source, but I get other oil elsewhere. I usually mix them all together. This would delute the soybean oil, would it not? :confused: would that still cause problems? :confused:

I do change oil very regular, and have heard of problem when burning veggie and not changing oil.

[dana linscott]

I have used almost exclusivly soybean oil wvo for several years now..as have most of the conversions I have helped with locally. Only two have had any problems with lube oil polymerization and in each case it was mainly due to very worn engines with excessive blowby. Blowby is exhaust gasses leaking past the rings and occurrs when they become worn out or siezed due to ring land coking.

When these combustion gasses leak by the rings and flow through the crankcase some of the contaminants in them (including partially and unburned vegoil) gets into the lube oil and can polymerize. Any vegetable oil can do this..not just soy oil. I suspect the few reported cases are much more due to excessive blowby than to the type of vegoil burned. If you are converting an old engine to vegoil it is best to check the oil you drain whan changing it for polymerization. If you discover it I reccomend changing it more often. Switching to another vegoil will not solve the problem though it might allow slightly longer oil change intervals.

Dana

[Twanoh Tom]

My Mercedes 300D has what I would call "excesive blowby" although it starts and runs well. After warm-up there is little or no smoke. I am about to convert this engine to run on veg. What does polymerization look like? I normally change oil at 3000 mile intervals. Is this often enough with a worn engine operating on veg?
TT

[drzvw]

If you are converting an old engine to vegoil it is best to check the oil you drain whan changing it for polymerization. If you discover it I reccomend changing it more often. Switching to another vegoil will not solve the problem though it might allow slightly longer oil change intervals.

Dana
How can I tell if my motor oil is polymerized?? I use only soy because that is what most of the Asian resturants I get oil from use.. Thanks Thomas Grease is Peace

[dana linscott]

You can easily tell if your lube oil is polymerizing due to vegoil contamination by taking a sample of your used oil (about 1/3 cup works well) and putting it in your refrigerator overnight in a tithgly closed jar. The first time you do this also take a similar sample of unused lube oil for comparison.

Remove the samples from the refrigerator and tilt them slightly. The fresh lube oil might be thick like honey but it will flow evenly. If your used lube oil acts like this it is not polymerized. But if it justs sits there at an angle..like Jello..it is polymerized.

This is bad for you engine for several reasons. Polymerized oil won't readily flow upon engine startup so bearings and cylinder walls take a beating. If your engine is turboed..your turbo bearings will also take a beating on stratup ..and tend to coke up faster.

Needless to say...if you run with polymerized oil..start saveing for a new engine. Or change your lube oil frequestly enough so it is not polymerized to Jello consistency ever. Or have your engine overhauled or sticky rings freed up to solve the blowby problem.

Hope this helps.

Dana

[drzvw]

I guess I can use Casteroil in the crankcase to keep it veggie... thanks Thomas

[Inspect2020]

Is there any Veggy based lube oil out there that can stand up to a diesel engine?

[KansasDiesel]

Dana, would the veggie do the same if you were using a full synthetic oil? :confused:

[dana linscott]

Dana, would the veggie do the same if you were using a full synthetic oil?

Yes.

I guess I can use Casteroil in the crankcase to keep it veggie... thanks Thomas

Is this available in diesel grade?

Dana